Crazy Tuning Ideas

[DaButcher]

Is 360hp a steep target? Yes, but considering the honda s2000 is pulling about 110hp per liter without a turbo thanks to their VTEC system and i have a better system in mind its definately not impossible.

HP is not all! NM is how strong the engine is..
If you have an engine with very much NM, you can put a lighter flywheel to get more HP and less NM..

heavier flywheel = more NM, but less HP.

Volvo B230A has 116hp, but 186nm.
honda crx vtech has 160hp, but only lousy 150nm!
Volvo b6304f has 204hp and 267nm!
b6304 + chip = 224hp/320nm.. more than twice as much NM!

Also the 160hp is at 6500nm and 150nm at 6000rpm!
This is a very exhausting car to drive!

Aim not only for HP, NM is atleast as important! especially when you have some weight with you in the car!

I think you can say that in general, more nm = more accelleration, more hp = more top-speed.

"theres no replacement for displacement"

[5lab]

you've got to remember that torque to the wheels is multiplied/divided by the gearbox - that is any car will produce more torque at a given number of revs in 1st gear than it will in second. therefore, if a car can only produce 150 @ 5000 revs, thats actually as much torque to the wheels as 300 @ 2500 revs, if you use a lower gear.. lower down torque is however considered better, as most cars with lower down torque are quieter, use less fuel and have a better torque curve (ie more area under the graph).

[foggyjames]

You still can't fit a B6304 in a 300 without major surgery! Are you sure its only 4" longer?! The 5-cyl, I can believe...but the 6? Crikey! I agree its a great engine, although early examples were plagued by reliablility problems. Get one that's 95-on, and you'll be absolutely fine.

A 5-cyl whiteblock would fit a treat...but to be honest, if you're going that far, you'll need a transmission swap on power grounds, so you might as well fit the 3.0. Of course it'll never even remotely look stock....but if its out and out power you're looking for...

The B36 looks pretty pants TBH...120bhp from a V8?! That's almost as lame as a Rover V8!

cheers

James

[Lonewolf]

First of all, b6304 is not V6! It's an INLINE6! eg. all cylinders in one row!
Second of all, b27-b280 is a V6. It's also known as PRV6, since it was a joint venture of Peugot, Renault and Volvo.

Ok, I was under the impression the B6304 was a V6 engine, that makes more sense about it not fitting in lengthways. So then none of the newer volvo engines are V's then?

[Fuse]

Ok, I was under the impression the B6304 was a V6 engine, that makes more sense about it not fitting in lengthways. So then none of the newer volvo engines are V's then?

Yeah except the new V8 in XC90.

[foggyjames]

Which is a Yamaha engine really

cheers

James

[Lonewolf]

Bout time volvo made a V8 engine, i bet it'd fit in lengthways to a 360 engine bay (i'm not speculating on the width and height factors)

[foggyjames]

If it's not a Volvo engine....might as well fit a SBC!

Volvo have made V8s for years...well kinda....they're based on Chevy blocks. If you want engines 101, do a google search for 'Volvo Penta', then for fun go 'Penta 740A'...which is impressively huge, if crap for what it is.

The Penta AQ171C is *the* engine to start with. B230 stroked to 2.5, 16v, hotter cams than the B234. Awesome engine. So much potential.

cheers

James

[DaButcher]

You still can't fit a B6304 in a 300 without major surgery! Are you sure its only 4" longer?! The 5-cyl, I can believe...but the 6? Crikey! I agree its a great engine, although early examples were plagued by reliablility problems. Get one that's 95-on, and you'll be absolutely fine.

A 5-cyl whiteblock would fit a treat...but to be honest, if you're going that far, you'll need a transmission swap on power grounds, so you might as well fit the 3.0. Of course it'll never even remotely look stock....but if its out and out power you're looking for...

The B36 looks pretty pants TBH...120bhp from a V8?! That's almost as lame as a Rover V8!

cheers

James

b36 is VERY old!! but you have some with a bit more output too..

[foggyjames]

The big problem with most of the Penta range (where most of the V8s are found), is that most of them were designed for boats (opposed to many of the AQ series, which were car engines first), so they're stroked.....not good for big power

cheers

James

[Lonewolf]

Well i might muck around with the B200 daily driver while i find out what engines will and wont work for the donor 360, its gonna be the gunea pig for the engine swap once the current b200 is removed. I'm busy playing with the intake right now, and the design of the airflow meter looks a bit of a joke to be honest, has anyone swapped successfully to a MAF meter thats less restrictive (ie no spring loaded metal flap in the middle). The black plastic ducting is fine as its getting some minor surgury done.

Now about the engine swap, the inline6 is not gonna happen too long, the early PRVs are infamous for their lack of reliability. So currently i'm tossing between the B5254 and a later model B280. I'm leaning towards the B280 for now, as theres more at the wreckers to pick from(and so cheaper), bigger displacement (which can likely be made to a 3L), and probably an easier fit. On the other side of the fence the B5254 has 4 valves per cyl, a genaerally more advanced design and some of the trick gadgetry i'll be modifying is already installed as well as having a better reputation than the PRV(PRV has been around longer though). I'm tending towards the PRV but i'm open to comments

PS: another crazy idea for the list just entered the head. Swap to a direct cylinder injection system, start running a low pressure waterless coolant through a high pressure system, fully polish all combustion chamber internals and run on a slightly higher grade fuel from now on, and buff the static compression ratio from 9.3:1 (unleaded b200e) to 14:1 or even more if you wanna run a water injection system or drive only on icy winter days

[V6 Man]

The main problem I can see is going to be the bellhousing. The I5 is a FWD engine and would need turning to suit RWD operations along with custom bellhousing (possibly flywheel and clutchpack too). The B280 only ever came with the AW71 auto box, but manual V6's did exist (pre '84 760's and the 260 range). Alternatively something from either Renualt or Peugeot may fit. Either way, the B280 uses an crank position sensor to control the ignition so some way of getting that to operate with a manual flywheel is needed (unless an aftermarket ignition system is used).
I am in the slow process of converting one of my 760's to manual, I'll let you know what flywheel/clutch combination works!

As you say, the B280's are available from scrapyards, BUT please ensure it has been mollycoddled. Due to its all alloy construction the biggest problem is lack of coolant changes resulting in porous blocks, filed liner seals, blown headgaskets etc. The heads are prone to serious warping if overheating has occurred. The oil problems of the early engines no longer exists and provided fluids are changed/kept at the correct levels and strengths they are a strong reliable unit with a bottom end capable of 500bhp.

Oh, they sound glorious too - here's a short clip of my Silver 760 powering away...(right click, save as etc...)

http://www.chesh.co.uk/242daypics/V6_driving.avi

[foggyjames]

I'd certainly go with a PRV, and as Rupert says, get a good late one (280), and they aren't as much trouble as folk would have you believe.

Of course there are also multi-valve heads available

cheers

James

[Lonewolf]

might go see what the local scrappers have got on offer then, I assume a good late model is B280 rather than the B28's, or is there a certain year model onwards in the B280 you are referring to. Also where should I be looking for the multi valve heads for them, I didnt think they existed.

My last crazy idea for the time being - A Volvo 360GLT 4WD

[Fuse]

PRV was used in Renaults and Peugeots also. For example Renault Safrane has 3.0l 24 valve PRV V6. All PRV's which are 90° configuration are pretty much same. Minor diffrencies might exist like oil pans, motor mountings etc... but with little modification they should fit. 60° PRV's are diffrent then. One guy here is fitting a 24V PRV from a Renault to a 264 Volvo. Says that the engine will fit with little modding so I guess they are pretty much same with Volvo PRV's,

http://www2.lut.fi/~jpennane/diary.htm

At the end of that page there are some pics of the Renault Safrane 3.0l 24V engine.

And by the way Volvo made 11 prototype 360's equipped with PRV V6. They were called 363CS. Some of them had more power some were stock.