Do you trust garages

Post by MJ » 10 Jun 2006 11:36 pm

I've always trusted the dealership as we've never had any trouble with them, but the other day, me and my dad were just having a quick check of the fluid levels in the 850, and I found two problems, albeit not major

Firstly the jubilee clip/ hose clip the arrow points too was very loose. Not slightly, but completly undone. That tube comes from the air filter and I thing goes into the engine.

Towards the bottom of the image you can see a plastic tube which goes from the top of the radiator down to the bottom of the air filter. I presume to get cold air into the thing. It wasn't connected to the tube at the bottom of the air box though, the two tubes just sort of met and semi overlapped, like this (()). The circle shows where they meet.

I wiggled the tube and got them to line up but I'm not sure if there should be any kind of clip, it could have shaken loose... It's very difficult to get to this

The last time it was in the garage I believe was for an MOT and some sensor was replaced, lambada, or something, dunno if it's related. Is it air, or exhaust, or something?

</rant>

Post by **Chris_C** » 10 Jun 2006 11:43 pm

Lambda goes into the exhaust, makes sure the car is getting the right AFR mix (well... roughly something like that

)

It could be an honest mistake if you have been there a while, there are a few garages I trust... well, two out of all the ones I've been two, but hten I try and do my own stuff anyway. If this was a first, I'd chalk it down to forgetfulness

Post by MJ » 10 Jun 2006 11:49 pm

Yeah, we're not considering changing garages because of it, but It's worrying how long it could have been like that, and how long untill it may have been noticed. Although the tube was still holding on, it could have come off and given the engine a load of unfiltered air...

There's a small local garage who we use occasionally as my dad knows the owners, and they did the air con, and the distributor on the 340, but we mainly use the stealership as they have all the records, official service sheets, genuine parts etc. And we've never really had any problems.

You also get a good relationdhip, I know my dad's had bulbs replaced for free, no parts or labour costs

Post by **pettaw** » 11 Jun 2006 12:14 am

Yeah, I'm with Chris on this one. Everyone's allowed one mistake. Erm, if it was done recently I would have a word with the service manager and say what you found, and just to let the techie know to be a bit more careful.

Post by **Chris_C** » 11 Jun 2006 12:21 am

Definately on the quiet word... they might have just taken on a idiot... do your bit for society and make him either a better mechanic after his b*llocking or jobless again if he's useless

Post by **jtbo** » 11 Jun 2006 10:00 am

I don't trust any garage no more, very bad experience usually, few times they make ok job, but usually at some point start to get sloppy, seems like new customer is taken care of properly but old customers are excepted to stick with them no matter what.

I have had following troubles in my cars after picking up from various garages:
Exhaust leaks
Exhaust hitting suspension/chassis
Empty or half empty battery
Broken alternator
Scratches, dirty fingerprints
Replaced expensive parts without contacting forehand and those were not even helping with problem. (expensive=50% of car worth)
Burn valves, because they had adjusted them wrong and tested how it goes, flooring etc.
Very bad oil leaks when I asked to fix small oil leak and to replace all oil seals at front side of engine.
Also dealership garage has always managed to fill full windshield wiper fluid tank with 2-3 litres and their fluid has diamonds in it according to price as for 1 litre price I can get over 10 litres from shop.
Also their tie wraps seem to cost about 100 times more than in shop...
Oh yes, driveshaft bolts were undone when picked car from clutch change and also needed to adjust clutch myself...

None of these had ever given even discount. When asking refund they just typically laughed.

So I'm really not using garage services anymore, it is completely waste of money and time as there is always new problems with car when it comes back from them.

Post by **mac** » 11 Jun 2006 10:52 am

Mornin' all,

MJ - First your 850 problem. The loose clip you show secures the inlet trunking from the the air filter housing to the engine. The consequence of it being left loose is the posibility of unfiltered air reaching the inlet manifold - not desirable but would not actually stop the engine starting/running. The loose pipe directs cool air from the front grill/radiator surround to the air filter housing. The sections just push together and the end you're worried about should have a shaped end that clips into the filter box - no fixings.

This line drawing should make it clear.

As to garages - well I'm biased of course (before I retired I was in 'the t'trade' almost all my working life) but as with all trades there are good and bad (I suspect if you searched hard enough you could even find a truthful politician). In my experience I have come across a small number of very, very, very good garages and a small number of very, very, bad ones but in the main most of them are ok and try to do a good honest job. They don't deliberately set out to rip you off. But, mechanics are human and humans make mistakes. (I make mistakes, and there is some doubt that I am completely human!!).

These days garages are under a great deal of time pressure and even the best will sometimes leave a clip undone.

Don't go over the top with the blame - but do TELL THEM if you find problems (in a nice way). It gives them good feedback (and who knows you might screw a discount on your next service).

It is very easy to become jaundiced with a bad experience, but really it iisn't as bad as folk-law makes out.

Mac.

Post by **V6 Man** » 11 Jun 2006 11:42 am

Hmm, there are a few select garages I'll use but only because they were recommended to me and I've found them to be fairly competant. Many are particularly useless.

Here are a couple of examples of poor service that the DAF main dealer in Derby has come up with with regard to our firms trucks.

X reg DAF 85;
Replaced clutch - forgot to tighten up air feed pipes to gearbox with resultant clutch failure the following day (caused a blockage of a large roundabout in Sheffield until the driver sorted the problem)

03 reg DAF XF;
Replaced broken sunvisor - fitted it back to front so it jammed and thus broke again. Fitted second replacement off centrs so cab curtains couldn't be closed. Rectified by driver.

Repaired/replaced headgasket - forgot to tighten up the intercooler pipes resulting in them blowing off and thus reduced power ot next to nothing as the ECU saw no boost and thus wouldn't provide fuel. Happened on a long hillclimb which had to be made at tickover until the driver found somewhere safe to pull in and rectify the problem.

Fitted new mirror to pass side - forgot to tighten bolts resulting in mirror falling off 1/2 mile down the road.

52 reg DAF XF
Repaired after an accident - forgot to reconnect wire to headlights, foglights and spotlights. rectified by driver. Also fitted front corner deflectors to the wrong sides and thus they are upside down!

Repaired/replaced headgaskets - forgot to tighten up fuel lines to injectors resulting in diesel leak and loss of power. Rectified by driver.

It seems their standard of checks before releasing a vehicle back into traffic leave a lot to be desired!!

Post by MJ » 11 Jun 2006 11:46 am

Yeah, I was thinking a quiet word would be in order, the 340 has the MOT approaching soon anyway.

Mac, you are the man! Where do you just get all these diagrams from

You are most certainly a very welcome additioon to V3M with your knowledge

Yikes, you seem to have had a bad time with the Daf dealers, I'm glad we've never had trouble like that

Post by **mac** » 11 Jun 2006 12:43 pm

Hi MJ, Where do I get the info from ?? By magic of course !!

Seriously though, before I retired I worked as an investigative engineer for the factory for 20yrs..and over time have collected a lot of info ('green books' - or 'blue' in the case of the 850 etc.)

I was with Volvo in 1976 when it aquired Daf (and the Daf 77 - oops sorry I mean the 300) and I was still there in '91' when the 300 prod.run ended.

Now I have to keep the 'grey cells' vaguely alive and it seems a shame not to share what knowledge I have. My wife ran an'84' 340 (in various versions) from 86 till we sold it last year (replaced with a 440GS) and I ran 300s as company lease cars until I retired. (now got a 940 Turbo estate).
Hava a look in the last couple of pages of the 'we need your pictures' thread and you can see some of my daily drives.

All the best Mac.

Post by **redline** » 11 Jun 2006 12:52 pm

maturity and a lifetime of mechanical experience ,

ahh there is no substitute !!!!!

Post by **petefarrell360** » 11 Jun 2006 08:54 pm

Well, some worrying stories there! Personally, I wouldn't let anyone touch my car that I didn't know and trust. The main reason being the lack of care for the actual car while it is within their 'care' due to it's age. The 'it's only and old Volvo' attitude does not impress me. So needless scratches, dents etc that might appear can be avoided if I don't let them near it. I've seen very expensive cars abused when being moved, parked with bumpers touching, doors opened into other cars etc.

Also as mentioned the pressures of time etc result in shortcuts or bodged jobs, or the pure rip off merchants who wish to make money for doing very little, telling you that had to replace half the car, and either charge you for not doing it, or charge you when it never needed doing.

Anything major when I don't have time or the knowledge is done by a Volvo trained mechanic who is a friend of the family who I know and trust.

At the end of the day everyone makes mistakes, but I've heard of too many to risk my car, such as the common one of forgetting wheel nuts due to interruptions.

Pete

Post by **Carl** » 12 Jun 2006 05:41 pm

I'm with Mac on this one. I haven't quite got his years of wisdom but I've grown up around/in the 'trade'. If you find a decent garage then keep goign back to them - and of course people occasionaly make mistakes. A friendly word with the service manager should be all that's needed - and if they're an honest outfit you should get an apology and the car rechecked over to make sure everything is now tightly together at the very least. If they try and wriggle out of then that would be the last time I used them.

I've heard of garages that have done this - made mistakes then denied that it could have been anything to do with them. Also the sort of places that give your car one of their 'free million point safety checks' and then find 'faults' and insist that they must be replaced before the car can be taken away as it's not safe to drive. There's not many of them, but it always pays to at leats try to understand whats been done, or even take someone along that knows if you're using a garage for the first time, so you know you're not being fleeced.

Incidentally I'm just helping my Dad with setting up his own MoT station, and there's also proper garage repairs workshop as well, so if anyone needs a decent place down south let me know!! He's been a mechanic for 30 years so has plenty of experience. He's even the mechanic for a proper 200SX drift car!